Episode 69: Missing Persons Investigations with Krista Pavey, PI
Missing persons investigations are just one of Private Investigator Krista Pavey's, a.k.a. SpyGirl, specialties. In this episode of The Investigation Game Podcast, Krista shares her story of becoming a private investigator, the “why” behind her focus on missing persons cases, and investigation best practices and applications.
Krista Pavey is a Private Investigator, entrepreneur, published author, advocate for justice and public speaker. Spending the first half of her career as C.O.O. of a multimillion-dollar corporation, Krista decided to become an investigator and opened her investigation firm in 2012. Krista helps people find peace of mind through seeking truth in their lives. She has been married for 28 years and has two successful and happy children.
Krista specializes in missing persons, cold cases, sentence mitigation, criminal defense cases and very selectively takes domestic case work. In private investigation, she is dedicated to helping her clients achieve success. She believes every case matters. She will fight for those who put their trust in her and her business. She believes investigative integrity is paramount to a successful outcome and takes tremendous pride in her work.
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Transcript
Leah Wietholter:
Hi, I'm Leah Wietholter, and this is The Investigation Game podcast.
Leah Wietholter:
Welcome to The Investigation Game Podcast. I'm Leah Wietholter, CEO and founder of Workman Forensics in Tulsa, Oklahoma. Today I have with me Krista Pavey. Krista is a private investigator, entrepreneur, published author, and a public speaker.
Leah Wietholter:
Spending the first half of her career as a chief operating officer of a multimillion dollar corporation, Krista decided to become an investigator and opened her firm in 2012. Krista helps people find peace of mind through seeking truth in their lives.
Leah Wietholter:
She's been married for 28 years and has two successful and happy children. Krista specializes in missing persons, cold cases, sentence mitigation, criminal defense cases, and very selectively takes domestic case work. In private investigation, she is dedicated to helping her clients achieve success.
Leah Wietholter:
She believes every case matters. She will fight for those who put their trust in her and her business. She believes investigative integrity is paramount to the successful outcome and takes tremendous pride in her work. Thank you for joining me today, Krista.
Krista Pavey:
Well, thank you for having me.
Leah Wietholter:
So, we've met a few times over the last maybe year or so, I think probably post 2020. Yeah.
Krista Pavey:
I think so.
Leah Wietholter:
I think all of it has been. Yeah. So, we've met a few times, and I've always been fascinated by your work on missing persons cases, which is where I'd like to focus today. But before we begin, will you share your story about why or how you decided to become a private investigator?
Krista Pavey:
I think I asked myself that question every single day. "Why did I do this?" How did I... Just, "Why?" Before I got into private investigation, I was working in the private sector, and I was a COO for a multimillion dollar company. My life was kind of headed in one direction, and because of some unforeseen obstacles I had to make a change, so quite literally a midlife crisis.
Krista Pavey:
But my experience in my former industry gave me a skill set that I thought might be useful in the investigation industry, and it's something I'd always been attracted to. So, I just thought, "Well, if not now, then will I ever try it?" So, I just did it.
Leah Wietholter:
You just made the leap.
Krista Pavey:
I just literally was, "I think I want to be a PI, and I think I can." So, I had no clue what the work was actually going to be like, but I had a lot of experience running a business. So, I think a lot of people get into the investigation industry and they have a lot of investigation skills, but they don't necessarily have the business and marketing side. So, it's something, if you're a teachable person, that you can learn. So, I felt like that I could learn what I needed to, and I feel like I have. So, here I am.
Leah Wietholter:
Yeah. That's awesome.
Krista Pavey:
Yeah. Thank you.
Leah Wietholter:
Which, I think that's actually how I found you was your marketing, because your marketing was under SpyGirl.
Krista Pavey:
Yeah, it is.
Leah Wietholter:
Tulsa SpyGirl.
Krista Pavey:
Yeah.
Leah Wietholter:
And I just really, I remember the day that you said, "Oh, let's meet up," which, because you had heard me on the PI Perspectives Podcast, I think.
Krista Pavey:
I did. Mm-hmm.
Leah Wietholter:
And then around the same time I just reached out to you.
Krista Pavey:
Which was crazy.
Leah Wietholter:
So weird. So, anyway, I just really loved whenever I got to tell my husband, "Oh. Hey, I'm going to go meet with SpyGirl today." So, that just made my day.
Krista Pavey:
I probably should be Spy Woman because of my age, but I have a really common name. When I started out, I was like, "Oh, my gosh. I'm really the only person in the world with my name." So, I was a little bit apprehensive about that, and I was trying to figure out what I wanted to put out for marketing.
Krista Pavey:
I had a call one day, and the caller just says, "Hey, are you that spy girl?" And I was like, "Well, yes, I am."
Leah Wietholter:
Love it.
Krista Pavey:
I just put it on my Facebook page, and I'm almost at 10,000 followers, which I'm super stoked about.
Leah Wietholter:
Wow.
Krista Pavey:
So, I've kind of not been working really hard at it. But lately I'm like, "Okay, I need to get past that 10."
Leah Wietholter:
Yes.
Krista Pavey:
You know?
Leah Wietholter:
Yeah, you do. So, if anybody listening, you need to go out and find... So, this is on your Facebook page?
Krista Pavey:
Mm-hmm. Right. Yes.
Leah Wietholter:
And what's your Facebook page?
Krista Pavey:
It's SpyGirl at Tulsa Private Investigation.
Leah Wietholter:
Okay. So, we need to go out and help push Krista over this 10,000 followers.
Krista Pavey:
Yes, please. Thank you.
Leah Wietholter:
Yeah, that would be so great. In Oklahoma, what did that process look like for you to go get your PI license when you made this decision?
Krista Pavey:
So, you have to have CLEET training, which it's basically three to four phases, depending on whether you want to do security or not. It's very basic. So, you have to spend extra time taking courses and educating yourself. And I knew from coming from a family of entrepreneurs, that one of the best ways to learn is to study under somebody that does it well. So, I just found really, really excellent mentorship, and I put in a lot, a lot of time, a lot of time and a lot of work. So, yeah.
Leah Wietholter:
Yeah. And it's a several week course, I think.
Krista Pavey:
Right. Right.
Leah Wietholter:
Yeah. And then a test at the end.
Krista Pavey:
I mean, the first is just general, and then phase three... Phase one is general. Phase three is investigative stuff. I'm sure that's what it's called in the coursework.
Leah Wietholter:
Yeah. I think it's called-
Krista Pavey:
Investigative stuff.
Leah Wietholter:
Oh, right. Yeah. Yeah.
Krista Pavey:
Actually. But, no. And then phase four is your carry class. So, all that stuff you have to do, all the boxes you have to check. Then you have to test out, and you have to go through all the backgrounds and get your agency and all of that stuff, so did all of that.
Leah Wietholter:
But I would agree that once you get that license, you still don't know what you're doing.
Krista Pavey:
Well, so everybody was like, "Oh, my gosh. I could do that. It doesn't sound very hard." And I'm like, "Yeah, right."
Leah Wietholter:
It's not.
Krista Pavey:
Going through the coursework isn't hard. Running and managing an agency and putting out quality work and being able to work in this industry is really, really hard.
Leah Wietholter:
Right.
Krista Pavey:
So, sure. The training might not be super hard. It's really not hard at all, but to survive is a completely different story. And I'm at my 10th year this year.
Leah Wietholter:
Oh, congratulations.
Krista Pavey:
So, I'm really excited about that.
Leah Wietholter:
I know. I saw on Google the other day, because I have to check every now and then forensic accounting, Tulsa, and make sure I'm still in the top organic links and all that stuff. Right.
Krista Pavey:
I see you, too. I see you, too.
Leah Wietholter:
Yeah. Yeah. And they give you a little nod when you pass that 10 year mark. They'll put "10-plus years" or whatever on your-
Krista Pavey:
Thank you, Google.
Leah Wietholter:
I know. Right.
Krista Pavey:
I mean, for thinking of just me.
Leah Wietholter:
I love that.
Krista Pavey:
But it is exciting though.
Leah Wietholter:
I mean, it's huge. It's a huge accomplishment.
Krista Pavey:
For me, it's so huge. I'm just so grateful for the clients that have entrusted their case work to me. I'm so grateful for my family who supported me and for my colleagues who have been there for me. It's been a wonderful experience, tough but wonderful.
Leah Wietholter:
Oh, yeah. For sure. I get it.
Krista Pavey:
I mean, I don't even know. If I knew everything I knew 10 years ago, I would probably say, "There is no way you're doing this. You are nuts."
Leah Wietholter:
Some things.
Krista Pavey:
Yeah.
Leah Wietholter:
Some things I would agree as well. I know we're hitting 12 years this year, and I'm like, "Hmm. Okay." So, what kind of cases or types of cases do you work in your practice?
Krista Pavey:
Well, you know when you start out, you just take anything reasonable. I'm not saying anything, because you always have people that ask you to do ridiculous things or illegal things or whatever. But you take anything reasonable.
Krista Pavey:
But now, the last several years my practice has been more focused on criminal case work. I'm an investigator for the Innocence Project, so I love post-conviction work. I do a lot of criminal defense in Oklahoma. We're kind of unique because we had a big ruling in 2020 with the McGirt decision, and so that's changed a lot of things. I've gotten a lot of McGirt cases, so I really love that.
Krista Pavey:
I still take some domestic case work if it's interesting to me, but really only if it's interesting to me. I'm not going to turn down an interesting cheater case or...
Leah Wietholter:
Right.
Krista Pavey:
And I love research, so anything fraud or research. Research based, fraud, genealogy, that's all in my wheelhouse. So, yeah. And of course, missing persons, working cold cases.
Leah Wietholter:
Yeah. So, cool.
Krista Pavey:
Yeah. It was kind of my cup of tea.
Leah Wietholter:
Yeah.
Krista Pavey:
Yeah.
Leah Wietholter:
Yeah. So, let's talk about the missing person's cases. Well, actually let's go back.
Krista Pavey:
Okay.
Leah Wietholter:
Let's go back just a little bit.
Krista Pavey:
Okay. Okay.
Leah Wietholter:
What were the first kinds of cases? Because if somebody has never done this work before, you said anything that's reasonable. But what did some of those reasonable things look like?
Krista Pavey:
So, I don't think my first case was reasonable, but I do have to bring it up because there were some cookies being stolen from a cookie factory. Yeah.
Leah Wietholter:
Actual cookies?
Krista Pavey:
Yeah, like somebody stole a cookie from a cookie jar.
Leah Wietholter:
Okay. Right, right, right.
Krista Pavey:
I sometimes nickname my cases, so that's the... So, anyways. Yeah. There were really pallets and pallets of cookies being stolen, and I had a lot of experience in-house surveillance. So, we were able to go in. It was very much in my wheelhouse. I looked really awesome after that. I'm like, "Well, here's what you need to redo and what you need to change." And sure enough, they were able to figure out who the cookie thief was.
Leah Wietholter:
Was it an inside job?
Krista Pavey:
It was an inside job, inside the cookie factory. And it was not a mouse. Yeah. It was a person. Yeah.
Leah Wietholter:
How were they getting like all these pallets of cookies out, like just backing a truck up?
Krista Pavey:
Yeah. Their cameras were pointed all willy-nilly. I mean, they didn't have a good system of how they would check people in and out of the... I mean, it's basic security stuff, really, actually. But it was kind of fun. You know? I mean, it's a fun tester case, and I was scared I was going to get something very serious that I wouldn't be able to handle. But that came quickly enough.
Krista Pavey:
One of my first cases was a missing person's case. I can't really discuss the details of that case in particular. But I guess in all of my decision making to become an investigator, I never really thought much about missing persons until one landed on my desk. And then as you know, a lot bubbled over for me in that area. And I was like, "Oh, wow. Maybe I could really make a difference. I understand what these people are going through."
Leah Wietholter:
Yeah. Yeah. So, this case showed up for you.
Krista Pavey:
Right. Mm-hmm.
Leah Wietholter:
And then do you want to talk about why that's important?
Krista Pavey:
Yeah. So, I sat down with the family, and right away the mother was like, "This person is missing, and my children are distraught." I mean, there are things that you go through in your childhood that you just kind of put out of your mind. But when I was 12, my sister went missing, and she was missing for over a year.
Krista Pavey:
So, I don't know why when I was thinking about doing investigative work I never really thought about missing persons. I was on more of a research trajectory, and I had done some work dealing with the criminal element. So, I was more focused in that area. But then the first missing person's case that landed on my desk, I was like, "Wow. These people need help. I can relate. Maybe I can make a difference here." And then that's what I set out to do.
Leah Wietholter:
Yeah. That's awesome. Okay. So I want to get into the details of missing persons, but first, let's take a quick break.
Leah Wietholter:
We love fun projects around here at Workman Forensics, and our newest adventure is taking place in the form of an escape room. Novel Mysteries is our first escape experience based on the novel Blood on the Mother Road: No Place to Hide by Tulsa author Mary Coley, the 2022 Oklahoma Book Award for Fiction recipient. Booking opportunities for this exciting immersive experience are available at novelmysteries.com.
Leah Wietholter:
So, welcome back to my conversation with Krista. Krista, how did you start learning about investigation processes and steps? You know that I'm really big on investigation processes, the Data Sleuth process. So, how did you learn what that type of investigation would even look like for investigating missing persons?
Krista Pavey:
I mean, really wonderful mentorship, one. If you know that you have things to learn, don't be afraid to ask and find somebody. Surround yourself with people that are better than you and work towards their level of expertise. So, I found great mentorship, one.
Krista Pavey:
And then the other thing I did was I became involved with people that were... Well, let me just say that people say that once you have a missing person in your family or you work with missing people, you're a part of the club, and it's a club that nobody wants to be a part of. So, I was a part of a club I didn't know that I didn't want to be a part of it that shouldn't... It's terrible it exists.
Krista Pavey:
But when you start volunteering... When I say volunteering, I worked with a lot, and I still do work with a lot of groups that specialize in search, some in search, some in search and rescue. There is a little differentiation there. Some do search support, rescue, but most of them have... Well, really all of them that I work with have SAR training. So, really boots on the ground, getting out and searching for people, but also understanding that there is a process.
Krista Pavey:
Anytime you start on a missing person's case, you don't just start from when somebody makes a call and says, "This person is missing." You have to start before they went missing. What was their story leading up to this? You can't assume anything. The biggest thing I would tell people working missing persons cases is, "Don't make assumptions." We do that all the time as an industry. Law enforcement does it, and for good reason, because most of the time it's what it's going to be. I mean, the simplest answer is usually the right answer, and so it's easy to make assumptions.
Krista Pavey:
But those cases that don't get solved a lot of times are because you made an assumption that is just like, "Oh, she's just a runaway. He just needed some time to himself. He's a grown man. He can leave if he wants to." You say those things and you make those assumptions, and then you've lost time. So, then you have to go back and try to build a timeline when you've lost time, and that's difficult sometimes.
Krista Pavey:
But you have to, you have to do all of those things. If you are an investigator and you're getting a case a week after law enforcement, even if they've interviewed people, even if they've built a timeline, you should do all of those things on your own because you never know. Maybe you see something, somebody that you're interviewing remembers something. Maybe they were scared to talk to law enforcement and they're more willing to open up to somebody in the private industry.
Krista Pavey:
So, re-walk all of those steps and see where the information leads you, not where your assumptions lead you. That's really what you have to do in the community, getting the information out there, "This person's missing," can build relationships in the community. I can have a missing flyer made in less than an hour. I can have search teams on the go if we feel like the person is in a distressed situation.
Leah Wietholter:
So, you mentioned search and rescue training and these search and rescue teams or people that can help you.
Krista Pavey:
Right.
Leah Wietholter:
Who provides that type of search and rescue training?
Krista Pavey:
So, the national organization is SAR, and all of the teams that I work with are actually... They go through lots and lots. It's actually a lot of training for volunteer work. So, you just have to really be so thankful for these people.
Krista Pavey:
One organization that I've worked with and their folks for a long time is Bridging the Gap. They've got some excellent search people. Oklahoma Search and Rescue Council out of Oklahoma City, they're fantastic. It's building relationships with people because every missing person case is different. I've taken a lot of case work where they haven't even filed a missing person's case yet because they're not... They haven't gone to law enforcement. They're not sure if their person is missing yet.
Krista Pavey:
So, the initial investigation is, "Hey, can you go see if our person's okay?" And if they're not where they're supposed to be, something's wrong. And then you walk them through the steps of how to file. Some people will call us a week later. Either law enforcement's doing something or they don't feel like they're doing something. Can you assist us? And then there are people that just absolutely cannot afford help, but they're in a very serious, traumatic situation. And we try to step in and help those people, too.
Leah Wietholter:
Yeah. So, the search and rescue volunteers that you're talking about, so a lot of these search teams that we might see or hear about on the news, a lot of them are volunteers?
Krista Pavey:
Most of them are volunteers, and I would say a good portion of them have decided to be on a search team because they have somebody in their life that's gone missing, which is what's really crazy.
Krista Pavey:
I mean, I went on a search. I believe it was in 2019. I think we were in... Well, I know we were in Delaware County, and there was a line of cars. I walked up, and one of my search buddies was like, "Krista, I want you to meet so and so. Their person is this missing person." And it's just heartbreaking.
Leah Wietholter:
Wow.
Krista Pavey:
You walk down a line of cars, and you realize that almost everybody in one of those cars has a family member that is now considered a cold case. And they're out there, boots on the ground-
Leah Wietholter:
Helping find somebody.
Krista Pavey:
... looking for somebody else's family, because they don't want them to feel the way that they feel.
Leah Wietholter:
Yeah. Wow.
Krista Pavey:
It's absolutely astounding. So, once you ever get involved, it's hard to distance yourself from it because of the community, for real.
Leah Wietholter:
Yeah.
Krista Pavey:
Yeah.
Leah Wietholter:
Yeah. Wow. What are some of the techniques? I'm curious. What are some of the techniques that maybe you've learned at these trainings, just a few of them that maybe we wouldn't think about if we've never... If a listener, myself I've never done a search. Maybe what's something, a technique or something to consider on these searches that you wouldn't have thought before you started doing the searches?
Krista Pavey:
So, my role... And I've done the physical searching part. But when I volunteer, I'm looking for, "Where's my best fit?" So, for me, a lot of times I work with the family. A lot of times family want to go out and search. Well, if you think that their person is deceased, you don't want to walk them into the woods where... So, we kind of manage the family. That's something I'm good at. I'm good at working with the family, managing the family.
Krista Pavey:
A lot of times our searchers will call me and say, "Okay, I need you to pull up directions. I need you to talk to this property owner. We need to go on this property. Can we get permission?" I mean, there's all just all different roles, but I have done the physical searching. And I'm telling you once that you've literally looked in drains and culverts and... It's crazy. It's sad, and sometimes it's scary. But somebody has to do.
Leah Wietholter:
Somebody has to do it. Yeah.
Krista Pavey:
Right. Right.
Leah Wietholter:
So, on these searches, we didn't talk about talking about this.
Krista Pavey:
Yeah. No, that's okay. That's okay.
Leah Wietholter:
So, you can just say, "Skip it," if you want.
Krista Pavey:
Yeah. No, it's okay.
Leah Wietholter:
But on the searches, if you did find something, is that part of the training, too, as part of a evidence recovery and things like that.
Krista Pavey:
Right. Yeah. Right. So, you don't want people out on your searches that obviously don't have the training to either... They either have to have a lead or they don't need to be involved, because we have to be very careful preserving evidence. It does not do us any good to find somebody's remains and then have a family member, somebody amateur, walking all over the crime scene.
Leah Wietholter:
Right.
Krista Pavey:
So, that's why we prefer to take small groups of trained individuals. We try to keep the family at bay, not because we don't want them to help. I mean, we obviously always want family to feel like that they're a part, but you, again, don't want to even further traumatize somebody or disturb a crime scene.
Leah Wietholter:
Right. For sure.
Krista Pavey:
So, very, very particular about those things. And like I say, all these folks that are on these teams are just really, really highly skilled and excellent. Most of them, law enforcement utilizes. They'll call them out when there's a critical missing. So, you know when law enforcement's calling you to come out, then they're not worried about you disturbing a crime scene.
Leah Wietholter:
Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Right, right, right, right.
Krista Pavey:
But, I mean, you do see on TV all these, and they've got 100 people. Yeah.
Leah Wietholter:
That's not realistic? I guess, sometimes.
Krista Pavey:
I mean, there are times where you get a lot of people show up. But like I say, you have to, in that situation, you have to have team leads. It takes a lot more work, because you have to be extremely diligent to make sure that nobody's, again, doing something that might disturb a crime scene because you only get one shot.
Leah Wietholter:
Right.
Krista Pavey:
One shot.
Leah Wietholter:
Right.
Krista Pavey:
So, that's not anything we want to be a part of. You want people to have justice if something nefarious has happened.
Leah Wietholter:
So, obviously, there's searches where you may find someone who's deceased, but then there's also searches for missing persons where I'm assuming they are alive.
Krista Pavey:
We have a lot more people alive than [inaudible 00:23:18].
Leah Wietholter:
Okay. Yeah.
Krista Pavey:
Yeah. I mean, which great.
Leah Wietholter:
Right.
Krista Pavey:
That's what we're hoping, but you don't ever hear those stories. You know?
Leah Wietholter:
I know.
Krista Pavey:
I mean, I find a lot of people alive.
Leah Wietholter:
Which is good news.
Krista Pavey:
Right. Right.
Leah Wietholter:
So, I guess in my mind, when you're talking about search teams specifically, it seems like we're going to go into the woods and do this whole thing, but then-
Krista Pavey:
They get called out on those type of cases, though. You know?
Leah Wietholter:
Yeah.
Krista Pavey:
What I take into my practice... I mean, I'm not a non-profit. And anybody that starts looking in the missing cases and you just start volunteering and volunteering and you're not making any money, you're doing it the wrong way. Okay?
Leah Wietholter:
Right.
Krista Pavey:
Unless you want to open a non-profit and then awesome, great for you. But I'm a for-profit organization, so most of my time has to be dedicated to for-profit work. That does not mean that I will not do some non-profit work, but it cannot dominate the majority of my time. I do have a heart. You know?
Leah Wietholter:
Right.
Krista Pavey:
And I do know that there are a lot of people that need help that can't afford it. If you get your business in a place that you can, then you should spend some time donating and helping people. Because I know a lot of people that listen to this podcast have the skill set.
Leah Wietholter:
Right.
Krista Pavey:
Right.
Leah Wietholter:
And I think that there's this interesting balance, too, because when I first started Working Forensics, I was trying to find a way to get some more experience, because my goal was if I can just work more cases than anyone else, paid or unpaid, I'm going to have more experience, which is going to lead to more paid engagements.
Krista Pavey:
That's my mindset in the beginning as well, "Whatever I can get my hands on."
Leah Wietholter:
Right. So, I think it was maybe year three or four of my practice, I then started volunteering with Tulsa police department and their Financial Crimes Unit and just working on... I just worked on embezzlements.
Krista Pavey:
Right.
Leah Wietholter:
I mean, I just got better. I understood what law enforcement wanted out of my reports. There was a lot that came from that that I don't think I would've gotten had I not volunteered. So, I think there's a really nice balance. But then I got too busy to do that work, and then a couple years ago we started volunteering again. So, I think it can be a nice...
Krista Pavey:
It's funny because anytime anybody asks me, "I want to be a private investigator. That sounds so fun," I tell them, "Okay, well first let me tell you your first several years you're going to work a lot. And when I say a lot, I mean a lot, lot."
Leah Wietholter:
Yes.
Krista Pavey:
"And not only that, you're going to be working when other people want to be at the dinner table, and so you have to make a lot of sacrifices." My family's made a lot of sacrifices for me to have this career and to be where I am right now.
Krista Pavey:
I worked one particular case with a missing autistic baby, seven, eight years old. I had to make the decision whether to stay home Father's Day or not, and it literally was soul crushing. But, I mean, it's a missing child, and I was with my team, what do I do?
Krista Pavey:
So, it's hard for me to give up holidays. It's hard for me to give up family time. But in that particular instance, it was what I needed to do. So, this is not an easy job. Missing person's case work, especially if somebody's missing for a nefarious reason and if there's foul plan involved, can be very dangerous.
Krista Pavey:
One of the most difficult things about working those types of cases is about to know when you're in danger and knowing when you need to not push beyond where you're at, to know how to communicate with law enforcement in the right way. I mean, there's a whole, whole lot that goes into it, and there have been investigators that have gotten themselves hurt because they just didn't know their limits.
Leah Wietholter:
Right.
Krista Pavey:
So, if somebody makes one person go missing, they're not afraid to make somebody else go missing.
Leah Wietholter:
Right.
Krista Pavey:
That's the reality.
Leah Wietholter:
Right.
Krista Pavey:
So, you just got to have a little bit of emotional intelligence and know what's okay and what's not okay and how would the family feel if somebody else ended up in a bad situation.
Leah Wietholter:
Right.
Krista Pavey:
Take that into consideration, too.
Leah Wietholter:
Right. So, to do a search for missing persons, we've talked about that. But if it's not suspected or if... I guess, what types of other searches do you do besides literal boots on the ground to look for a missing person, maybe using technology or social media?
Krista Pavey:
Right. So, I mean, you get everything from just stuff we all do, general locates like, "So and so isn't paying child support," to, "I haven't talked to my birth dad." I mean, those aren't really missing people, but you're still finding people.
Leah Wietholter:
Sure. Yeah.
Krista Pavey:
But I get a lot of calls for people that have adult children or adult family members who are either mentally ill or they're addicts. So, they know that they're alive, but they haven't heard from them. Maybe they didn't check in over Christmas or on a birthday or they've fallen out of some typical habit, and then they'll call us, "Hey, we need to see if this person's okay. We need to see if we need to file a missing person's report." I do a lot of missing, mentally-ill adults.
Leah Wietholter:
Interesting.
Krista Pavey:
That's a whole nother episode of a podcast about mental health and homelessness. But I've developed... The other thing I tell people is, "Know your area. Know your city. Know your state." I mean, I know so many homeless people. I'm friends with a lot of homeless people. I know their stories. They know me. If I'm concerned that somebody is missing and they're homeless, I have people I can talk to in the community that's taken a long time for me to nurture. And honestly, it's been such a blessing getting to know so many of these folks. So, my job is rewarding in a million ways, and that is one of them.
Krista Pavey:
But know your community. Understand the people that you're looking for. Understand the illness. Somebody says, "My missing person is schizophrenic." If you don't understand schizophrenia, spend some time studying. Understand. It's going to help you understand their behavior. It's going to help you find them.
Leah Wietholter:
Right.
Krista Pavey:
Talk to their family. Talk about their likes and dislikes and what their quirks are and the things that they will do and the things that they would never do.
Krista Pavey:
And it's the same thing for people that fall into addiction. What will they do? What will they not do? What drugs are they using? When they usually get in too deep, what does that look like in the past? So, a lot of those.
Krista Pavey:
And then you have silver alerts. You have a lot of folks that their parents are falling into dementia, but they're not really sure yet if they should take the car or the car keys. They're just kind of teetering, and then they're missing. That's a whole interesting dynamic, how you look for people that are falling into dementia. They have some patterns and habits just like autistic children have patterns and habits, are attracted to water.
Krista Pavey:
Dementia patients will a lot of times visit places that they remember from their past. So, there are just different things that you have to know about each different type of person that goes missing.
Leah Wietholter:
All right. So, thank you so much for taking time to talk with me today-
Krista Pavey:
No, thank you.
Leah Wietholter:
... and to share your experience and stories. So, if any of our listeners would like to connect with you, what's the best way to do so?
Krista Pavey:
Okay. So again-
Leah Wietholter:
Follow.
Krista Pavey:
Follow me at SpyGirl at Tulsa Private Investigation on Facebook. I'm theRealSpyGirl on Instagram and Twitter. My website is tulsaprivateinvestigation.com. My phone number's on all of those. You can reach out to me, talk to me.
Leah Wietholter:
Okay.
Krista Pavey:
You know?
Leah Wietholter:
Well, thanks so much. Well, hopefully you'll cross over that 10,000.
Krista Pavey:
I want to cross over that 10,000. Yeah. I said I was going to do it this summer, so I'll see.
Leah Wietholter:
Well, maybe this will help you do that.
Krista Pavey:
Maybe this will be the thing. Right?
Leah Wietholter:
That's right. All right. Well, thank you so much, Krista.
Krista Pavey:
Thank you.
Leah Wietholter:
Thank you for listening to The Investigation Game Podcast. For more information on any of the topics brought up on this show, visit workmanforensics.com. If you enjoyed our show, please be sure to subscribe and leave a review. You can also connect with us on any social media platform by searching Workman Forensics.
Leah Wietholter:
If you want to learn more about using data and forensic accounting engagements in fraud investigations, make sure to check out my book Data Sleuth, available on Amazon or anywhere else you like to buy your books.